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Re: Katy Perry victimized by another dumb jury


Phil, there was damning evidence by the plaintiff’s expert witness. Todd Decker.

it's not that complicated.

 both sides experts had previously characterized an eight-note ‘ostinato,’ [sign in to see URL]. a repeating sequence of musical figures within both songs”

In Decker’s opinion, those ostinatos share “five or six points of similarity,” including pitch, rhythm, texture, a pattern of repetition, melodic shape and timbre, or “the quality and color of a sound.” He also added that the “descending melodies” of both ostinatos are unique. “I have not seen another piece that descends in the way these two do,” he noted.

also, the jury heard that joyful noises had been streamed over 5 million times. So this song was popular and was not irrelevant. They found it hard to believe that no one on her team being in the music business hadn't heard it.


Last edited by snowpixie, 8/25/2019, 5:56 pm
8/25/2019, 5:54 pm Link to this post PM snowpixie Blog
 
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Re: Katy Perry victimized by another dumb jury


quote:

snowpixie wrote:

Phil, there was damning evidence by the plaintiff’s expert witness. Todd Decker.

it's not that complicated.

 both sides experts had previously characterized an eight-note ‘ostinato,’ [sign in to see URL]. a repeating sequence of musical figures within both songs”

In Decker’s opinion, those ostinatos share “five or six points of similarity,” including pitch, rhythm, texture, a pattern of repetition, melodic shape and timbre, or “the quality and color of a sound.” He also added that the “descending melodies” of both ostinatos are unique. “I have not seen another piece that descends in the way these two do,” he noted.

also, the jury heard that joyful noises had been streamed over 5 million times. So this song was popular and was not irrelevant. They found it hard to believe that no one on her team being in the music business hadn't heard it.



And the defense's expert witness Lawrence Ferrara testified that both songs shared ostinatos that were a lot like those in older songs. If they were not unique to those two songs and had been used before how did Flame's song manage to secure an exclusive copyright to them? And couldn't Katy and the other songwriters have heard some of those older, familiar songs and gotten inspiration from them, including Flame?

Lawrence Ferrara is every bit the expert that Todd Decker is and New York University stands up quite well to Wash U in St. Louis. So which expert opinion should the jury have believed?

What led them to believe Todd Decker rather than Lawrence Ferrara?

It appears to be a little more complicated than what you believe it to be. It wasn't simply a matter of picking the obviously right side since that is not what the jury did. They had to go with the side which they liked better, not the one with the most merit.

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8/25/2019, 7:13 pm Link to this post PM Philer Blog
 
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Re: Katy Perry victimized by another dumb jury


The problem of dueling experts is another problem that plagues the jury system in general, not just in this case. How are jurors who are not experts themselves in some subject supposed to know which expert to believe?

A common way they seem to handle it is by picking the expert who is working for the side they favor. They favor that side so naturally he or she is the expert who is more believable to them.


8/26/2019, 3:04 am Link to this post PM Philer Blog
 
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Re: Katy Perry victimized by another dumb jury


he is a very impressive expert witness, whom juries have listened too in the past. Under oath, he told the truth that they were alike but then tried to say that classical and western music had similar songs, and lost the jury.

it's that simple.
8/26/2019, 5:25 pm Link to this post PM snowpixie Blog
 
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Re: Katy Perry victimized by another dumb jury


quote:

snowpixie wrote:

he is a very impressive expert witness, whom juries have listened too in the past. Under oath, he told the truth that they were alike but then tried to say that classical and western music had similar songs, and lost the jury.

it's that simple.



I doubt it. It's more likely as simple as the jury favoring the nice Christian rapper over the big bad pagan Katy Perry.

Those eight notes in the rapper's song are not even the same eight notes in Katy's song. And there is so much more to Katy's song that has no connection to his that it's almost ridiculous to compare the two songs.

I think this a phenomenon that is more likely to occur again when someone's song is very simple like that of the rapper and mostly consists of rapping rather than melody. What little melody it has, no matter how simple or similar to something in other songs, will be so important to the song that it will be the focus of attention. Unfortunately in this case it's very similar to sequences in other songs that predate it and not just the similar sequence in Katy's song.

8/28/2019, 2:32 am Link to this post PM Philer Blog
 
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Re: Katy Perry victimized by another dumb jury


Philer may I refer you to the (great) many similar cases which did not involve a female artist?

Hell some even found in favor of female artists!

care to discuss the case of "Lady GaGa" vs "Rebecca Francescatti" ? (two women)

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8/28/2019, 4:57 pm Link to this post PM mais oui Blog
 
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Re: Katy Perry victimized by another dumb jury


quote:

mais oui wrote:

Philer may I refer you to the (great) many similar cases which did not involve a female artist?

Hell some even found in favor of female artists!

care to discuss the case of "Lady GaGa" vs "Rebecca Francescatti" ? (two women)



I would need to hear a full version of Francescatti's Juda and compare it to GaGa's Judas. The case was decided by a judge rather than a jury and Francescatti claimed that it needed to be decided by a jury who knew something about music. It's unlikely she would have gotten that kind of jury here.

Our juries seem to be largely ignorant about whatever subject matter they are dealing with. Of course that doesn't keep them from having preferences.

Cases found in favor of female artists, likely a rarity, may have been based on solid evidence. I remember the case involving one of my favorite musicians, George Harrison. The "My Sweet Lord" case. It was disappointing that his hit was largely a ripoff of The Chiffon's "He's So Fine" but musicians can make honest mistakes. They remember music that they've heard. It's one of the hazards of being a musician and a songwriter to "create" something new which is really something you've already heard and have simply modified either a lot or just a little.

I love both of these beautiful songs but the similarity is obvious. They use essentially the same melody which is also the magic in any song as well as the most difficult thing to create originally.





8/28/2019, 10:42 pm Link to this post PM Philer Blog
 


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