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katie5445 Profile
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Re: Another one!


But they don't, OR. Salem prison is made up of 35% mentally ill, every few years the prisons guards go on strike as it is difficult to separate the mental criminals from 'normal" criminals and of course the mentally ill suffer the violence. There other complaints, we aren't mental health professionals. What happens, there is no place for the mentally ill, so the guards take a raise and are allotted extra benefits and calm down for a few yrs, viscious cycle.
9/12/2020, 7:29 am Link to this post PM katie5445 Blog
 
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Re: Another one!


quote:

katie5445 wrote:

But they don't, OR. Salem prison is made up of 35% mentally ill, every few years the prisons guards go on strike as it is difficult to separate the mental criminals from 'normal" criminals and of course the mentally ill suffer the violence. There other complaints, we aren't mental health professionals. What happens, there is no place for the mentally ill, so the guards take a raise and are allotted extra benefits and calm down for a few yrs, viscious cycle.



Yes, not sure who obliterated the mental health system that used to separate them from ordinary criminals and prisons.
Reagan seems to have cut funding.
Others claim it was the movie, "One Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest".

But it should be clear we need separate systems for mentally ill and criminals.
Criminals are supposed to be given a deterrent punishment, so that they can be let out and not want to risk it again.
But since mentally ill may never be allowed out, it is much better for all if the environment is as compassionate as possible.
9/12/2020, 5:26 pm Link to this post PM Rigby5
 
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Re: Another one!


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That is part of my point, in that once a person is evaluated as a danger by a psychiatric examination, they can keep them locked up for ever. Which prisons can't do. Prisons are required to let them out after standard sentences, parole, good behavior, etc.-Rigby



As I pointed out in the opening post prisons are not required to let people out on good behavior which was the phony excuse for letting out Jablonski. If prisons had to do that Leslie Van Houten would have been paroled years ago instead of being kept behind bars for more than 50 years. She has behaved well in prison for a long time but still hasn't been released for good behavior.

What you need to realize is that prisons and parole boards deal with people as they wish to do. If they don't want to let people out they don't do so. So they had to want to let Jablonski out which indicates that they did not care about the young woman he murdered nor potential victims in the future. Nor their families.

Talking about mental institutions is just side tracking this discussion into an area that doesn't even apply to people like Jaoblonski, a classic Prima Donna type. There is no need for such people to be placed in mental institutions. They just need to remain in prison or be executed.
9/13/2020, 4:08 pm Link to this post PM Philer Blog
 
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Re: Another one!


quote:

Rigby5 wrote:

quote:

katie5445 wrote:

But they don't, OR. Salem prison is made up of 35% mentally ill, every few years the prisons guards go on strike as it is difficult to separate the mental criminals from 'normal" criminals and of course the mentally ill suffer the violence. There other complaints, we aren't mental health professionals. What happens, there is no place for the mentally ill, so the guards take a raise and are allotted extra benefits and calm down for a few yrs, viscious cycle.



Yes, not sure who obliterated the mental health system that used to separate them from ordinary criminals and prisons.
Reagan seems to have cut funding.
Others claim it was the movie, "One Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest".

But it should be clear we need separate systems for mentally ill and criminals.
Criminals are supposed to be given a deterrent punishment, so that they can be let out and not want to risk it again.
But since mentally ill may never be allowed out, it is much better for all if the environment is as compassionate as possible.



The novel "One Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest" might have been a bigger factor than the film. The film is inferior to the novel, one of my favorites. The film is one of my least favorite movies.

But the issue of mental institutions for the criminally insane is not relevant in this case. A person like Jablonski does not belong in a mental institution. Where he really belonged was on death row.
9/13/2020, 4:13 pm Link to this post PM Philer Blog
 
katie5445 Profile
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Re: Another one!


quote:

Rigby5 wrote:

quote:

katie5445 wrote:

But they don't, OR. Salem prison is made up of 35% mentally ill, every few years the prisons guards go on strike as it is difficult to separate the mental criminals from 'normal" criminals and of course the mentally ill suffer the violence. There other complaints, we aren't mental health professionals. What happens, there is no place for the mentally ill, so the guards take a raise and are allotted extra benefits and calm down for a few yrs, viscious cycle.



Yes, not sure who obliterated the mental health system that used to separate them from ordinary criminals and prisons.
Reagan seems to have cut funding.
Others claim it was the movie, "One Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest".

But it should be clear we need separate systems for mentally ill and criminals.
Criminals are supposed to be given a deterrent punishment, so that they can be let out and not want to risk it again.
But since mentally ill may never be allowed out, it is much better for all if the environment is as compassionate as possible.



Reagan did the right thing, till then persons were able to sanction a wife cause they were tired of her or a teen who was seen not to behave in a mental institution when they were not mentally ill including being sterilized. What he promised and did not do was build more institutions for the criminally mentally ill, those who were not criminals building half way houses, leaving the mentally ill to the street. Then you have to quantify mental illness as well, most are not criminals, suffering from depression, anxiety, OC, agoraphobia, hypochrondria, etc. all are mental illnesses but not a usually a danger to any of us, or for that matter psycho/sociopathic mental illnesses.

Personally I loved the film and the book of Cuckoo's Nest but I worked 2 yrs in a county psych ward 67/68 and both the book and movie made it look like a palace. My favorite Kesey book is "Sometimes a Great Notion." Claim to fame, my youngest daughter is friends with Kesey's daughter Sunshine.
9/14/2020, 4:28 am Link to this post PM katie5445 Blog
 
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Re: Another one!


quote:

Personally I loved the film and the book of Cuckoo's Nest but I worked 2 yrs in a county psych ward 67/68 and both the book and movie made it look like a palace. My favorite Kesey book is "Sometimes a Great Notion." Claim to fame, my youngest daughter is friends with Kesey's daughter Sunshine.-katie



I've seen the film based on "Sometimes A Great Notion" but haven't read the book. As a fan of the novel "One Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest" I was not at all happy with the film based on that novel. For one thing, the casting was botched. Jack Nicholson did a poor job of portraying McMurphy, one of the best and most interesting characters in literature.

The author Ken Kesey never saw the film. He didn't miss anything worth viewing.
9/15/2020, 3:43 am Link to this post PM Philer Blog
 
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Re: Another one!


quote:

katie5445 wrote:

quote:

Rigby5 wrote:

quote:

katie5445 wrote:

But they don't, OR. Salem prison is made up of 35% mentally ill, every few years the prisons guards go on strike as it is difficult to separate the mental criminals from 'normal" criminals and of course the mentally ill suffer the violence. There other complaints, we aren't mental health professionals. What happens, there is no place for the mentally ill, so the guards take a raise and are allotted extra benefits and calm down for a few yrs, viscious cycle.



Yes, not sure who obliterated the mental health system that used to separate them from ordinary criminals and prisons.
Reagan seems to have cut funding.
Others claim it was the movie, "One Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest".

But it should be clear we need separate systems for mentally ill and criminals.
Criminals are supposed to be given a deterrent punishment, so that they can be let out and not want to risk it again.
But since mentally ill may never be allowed out, it is much better for all if the environment is as compassionate as possible.



Reagan did the right thing, till then persons were able to sanction a wife cause they were tired of her or a teen who was seen not to behave in a mental institution when they were not mentally ill including being sterilized. What he promised and did not do was build more institutions for the criminally mentally ill, those who were not criminals building half way houses, leaving the mentally ill to the street. Then you have to quantify mental illness as well, most are not criminals, suffering from depression, anxiety, OC, agoraphobia, hypochrondria, etc. all are mental illnesses but not a usually a danger to any of us, or for that matter psycho/sociopathic mental illnesses.

Personally I loved the film and the book of Cuckoo's Nest but I worked 2 yrs in a county psych ward 67/68 and both the book and movie made it look like a palace. My favorite Kesey book is "Sometimes a Great Notion." Claim to fame, my youngest daughter is friends with Kesey's daughter Sunshine.



I did not know that. Interesting perspective.
9/15/2020, 8:59 pm Link to this post PM Rigby5
 
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Not a perspective but a fact. The last sterilization in OR. was in 1995, I found that shocking and the won millions in a lawsuit.
9/19/2020, 4:15 am Link to this post PM katie5445 Blog
 
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Re: Another one!


Good to remove old abusive institutions, but bad to not replace them with new and better ones, and use prisons instead.
A woman is not better off imprisoned for life than forced to have an unnecessary hysterectomy.
9/20/2020, 2:48 pm Link to this post PM Rigby5
 
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Re: Another one!


What is extremely creepy and shows how gross this country was not so long ago. You could institutionalize your wife instead of divorcing her and claim "mentally ill," you could put a teenage boy in an institution for things like "disobedience," cutting school, shop lifting, fighting, you could put your daughter in an institution for "promiscuity" and be sterilized. None should have been in any mental institution or sterilized or recieve jail time.
9/24/2020, 3:45 am Link to this post PM katie5445 Blog
 


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