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Philer Profile
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Re: Police Brutality Incites Riots


quote:

Rigby5 wrote:

quote:

Philer wrote:

quote:

Rigby5 wrote:

quote:

Philer wrote:

While the Boston massacre should not have happened, it doesn't follow that it should have led to a revolution against the British. That resulted in many more people being killed needlessly. And of course eventually to our own massively destructive Civil War about 80 years later which would likely not have happened if we had remained a part of the British Empire.

Whenever wars can be avoided they need to be.



What I disagree about is that the US likely should have split up.
It is WAY too big.
The South and the North should never be one country.
And likely the west should be a different country as well.
And no, I am not a Southerner.
Born in WI.
The way to have avoided the Civil War would have been to split up earlier, when it was clear they had nothing in common and the North wanted to abuse the south.



I agree to some extent. If splitting up was an alternative to remaining politically aligned that would have prevented The Civil War it would have been preferable. The notion that a country divided was worse as Lincoln suggested could hardly have been true.

Of course splitting from the British Empire helped to inspire the efforts of Southern states to try to split from the North. That first questionable rebellion appears to have eventually led to another one which is still having negative political repercussions.



The bigger the more distant and corrupt.
There just is no reason for a large country.
Economic unions provide all the benefits and none of the negatives.
States used to work, but the federal government has destroyed states to the point they really no longer exist.



Any government, big or small, can tyrannize people and harm them. State governments are no different in that regard from the federal government. Even on a local government level look at what's been happening recently. Police brutality is a way for local governments to harass citizens of a community.

The goal with our federal government should be to have an overriding government that functions well which helps to maintain the quality of state and local governments. Of course it doesn't help when that federal government has some of the same major flaws plaguing state governments, including a passion for the "war on drugs."
6/19/2020, 6:41 am Link to this post PM Philer Blog
 
Philer Profile
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Re: Police Brutality Incites Riots


quote:

Geezess wrote:

"How much of that terrible mistreatment by the British was propaganda?"

Are you suggesting the videos of State sponsored police violence, that we have seen with our own eyes are propaganda, fake news,
and so not real ?
Why ?



No. What I was suggesting was that some of the claims of British terror and harassment of Americans leading up to the Revolutionary War that katie mentioned may have been propaganda aimed at getting more Americans ready and willing to fight that war.

We don't have any video or film from those days. Too bad. It would be interesting to view.
6/19/2020, 6:46 am Link to this post PM Philer Blog
 
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Re: Police Brutality Incites Riots


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katie5445 wrote:

If you get out of 1950/60 history you read exactly why there was a revolution. You choose Philer to ignore it and still want to make it over a tea party or the Boston Massacre. The abuses suffered I listed is why the Russians, the French had a revolution or in modern day many other countries, it was no different in the states because they were British white guys.



It's not a matter of choosing to ignore it, katie. I just don't know that it took place. Propaganda was not a 20th century invention.

But even if the British were very abusive, so were some of the founding fathers. Some of them even owned slaves. And it doesn't follow from the British being abusive that a war should have been fought which would result in an even bigger disaster down the road - The Civil War.
6/19/2020, 6:50 am Link to this post PM Philer Blog
 
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Re: Police Brutality Incites Riots


Yeah you are choosing to ignore history, "abusive" in what sense? What is the difference in the US revolution compared to France or Russia or in more modern history, Chile and Pinochet. You can't use slaves in the Revolution, 1775 is far different than 1860.
6/19/2020, 7:12 am Link to this post PM katie5445 Blog
 
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Re: Police Brutality Incites Riots


I simply don't know how abusive the British were to Americans because I don't know how much of the alleged abuse was propaganda. Obviously enough people believed the war was justified but that doesn't mean that it was.

As George Bernard Shaw said, "History lies."
6/19/2020, 7:15 am Link to this post PM Philer Blog
 
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Of course it does, you think what I've posted I learned in the 50s/60s in history, hardly, not even close. It was a midnight ride and tea dumping over taxes, which doesn't even touch the reality. A dog had a better life.
6/19/2020, 7:41 am Link to this post PM katie5445 Blog
 
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Re: Police Brutality Incites Riots


If you "simply don't know" why quote Shaw? Just say, I don't know....
6/19/2020, 7:44 am Link to this post PM katie5445 Blog
 
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Re: Police Brutality Incites Riots


To be fair, the polls during the revolutionary times actually were only about a third in favor of rebellion., a third against it, and a third who did not care.

But it just can never work to not have local jurisdiction and self rule. The idea that Parliament would pass laws and taxes without any colonial representation is just inherently abhorrent.
6/19/2020, 4:25 pm Link to this post PM Rigby5
 
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Re: Police Brutality Incites Riots


quote:

Philer wrote:

quote:

Geezess wrote:

"How much of that terrible mistreatment by the British was propaganda?"

Are you suggesting the videos of State sponsored police violence, that we have seen with our own eyes are propaganda, fake news,
and so not real ?
Why ?



No. What I was suggesting was that some of the claims of British terror and harassment of Americans leading up to the Revolutionary War that katie mentioned may have been propaganda aimed at getting more Americans ready and willing to fight that war.

We don't have any video or film from those days. Too bad. It would be interesting to view.



Tory, batty boy ?
6/19/2020, 6:03 pm Link to this post PM Geezess Blog
 
Rigby5 Profile
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Reply | Quote
Re: Police Brutality Incites Riots


quote:

Geezess wrote:

quote:

Philer wrote:

quote:

Geezess wrote:

"How much of that terrible mistreatment by the British was propaganda?"

Are you suggesting the videos of State sponsored police violence, that we have seen with our own eyes are propaganda, fake news,
and so not real ?
Why ?



No. What I was suggesting was that some of the claims of British terror and harassment of Americans leading up to the Revolutionary War that katie mentioned may have been propaganda aimed at getting more Americans ready and willing to fight that war.

We don't have any video or film from those days. Too bad. It would be interesting to view.



Tory, batty boy ?



Any government using military troops on civilians is inherently abhorrent and disqualified to govern.
We should have dissolved government after the Kent St. massacre.
6/20/2020, 6:37 pm Link to this post PM Rigby5
 


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